Black Girls Sew: The Book! a chat with Hekima Hapa and Leslie Ware

0.75x 1x 1.25x 1.5x 2x 0:0000:26:03 Black Girls Sew: The Book! a chat with Hekima Hapa and Leslie Ware

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Hekima Hapa

Hekima Hapa is the founder of the nonprofit, community organization Black Girls Sew in Bedford-Stuyvesant. Not only is Hapa the founder, but she is a fashion designer and a business owner of Harriet’s by Hekima (HbyH), a Harriet’s Alter Ego company. Hapa is investing her over two decades of experience in fashion styling, fashion merchandising, sewing, and designing to teach courses for Black Girls Sew to leave the youth excited about education in sewing, design, and entrepreneurship. She has also co-authored the book Black Girls Sew with Lesley Ware.

Lesley Ware

Lesley Ware is an author, educator, entrepreneur, and personality who has written five books: Sew Fab: Sewing and Style for Young Fashionistas, My Fab Fashion Style File, How to Be a Fashion Designer, 101 Ways to Love Your Style and Black Girls Sew.

Lesley’s passion for inspiring youth began when she earned her degrees in Elementary Education and Public Administration and continued when she orchestrated national programs for institutions like the W.K. Kellogg Foundation and Girl Scouts of the USA.

She has created fashion education programs for the Parsons School of Design, Metropolitan Museum of Art with the Costume Institute, Pioneer Works, Museum of the City of New York, New Visions, New York Times Student Journeys, and other institutions.

Insights from this episode:

  • Insights into what led Lesley and Hekima to write their book
  • How they chose the fashion icons to interview in their book
  • How denim is connected to black ancestry
  • Insights on how they bring in fashion and black cultural knowledge
  • Lessons Hekima and Lesley learned while writing their book during the pandemic
  • The lessons they hope people will learn from reading their book

Quotes from the show:

  • “I talk to people all the time about how easy it is to upcycle denim and how easily and readily available it is, but it is not something easy to produce” -Hekima Hapa in “Stitch Please”
  • “It is really important that we think about it [denim] historically: it being connected to cotton, and how our ancestors being here” -Hekima Hapa in “Stitch Please”
  • “Every time that I get an opportunity to do anything, especially working on books, in my head I don’t know if I’m gonna be able to do this again, so I give it everything that I possibly can” -Lesley Ware in “Stitch Please”
  • “The logistics of writing a book in the pandemic present challenges and opportunities” -Lesley Ware in “Stitch Please”
  • “I think the book itself is like a love letter to Black girls, and that’s something that I really love about it” -Lisa Woolfork in “Stitch Please”
  • “To get your stitch together, you’ve got to write it down” -Lesley Ware in “Stitch Please”
  • “Just keep trying even when it seems impossible, it doesn’t seem like it’s gonna happen: whether it’s stitching and you are making a garment, or it’s really like stitching in life” -Hekima Hapa in “Stitch Please”

Stay Connected:

Lisa Woolfork

Instagram: Lisa Woolfork

Twitter: Lisa Woolfork

Hekima Hapa

Instagram: Hekima Hapa 

Twitter: Hekima Hapa 

Facebook: Hekima Hapa

Lesley Ware

LinkedIn: Lesley Ware 

Instagram: Lesley Ware 

Twitter: Lesley Ware 

This episode was produced and managed by Podcast Laundry.

Read Full Transcript

[00:00:00] Lisa Woolfork: It's national sewing month. And we are talking with Leslie we and Hakeem Hapa co-authors of black girls sew the book. Thank you so much to our Patreon supporters. And those of you who are helping us reach 200 additional Patreon supporters by the end of 2022, the money you give to black women's stitch sustains a community of black creatives, artists, and content makers.
[00:00:25] Lisa Woolfork: Thank you for your support. Here we go.
[00:00:32] Lisa Woolfork: Hello, stitchers. Welcome to stitch, please. The official podcast of black women's stitch, the sewing group, where black lives matter. I'm your host Lisa wool Fort I'm a fourth generation sewing enthusiast. With more than 20 years of sewing experience. I am looking forward to today's conversation. So sit back, relax.
[00:00:54] Lisa Woolfork: And get ready to get your stitch together. Hello [00:01:00] everybody. And welcome to the stitch police podcast. I am your host Lisa Wolf fork. And as I say every week, this is a very special episode because this episode features be two bees. Behind black girls. So the book I'm talking of course, about Hakeem Hapa and Leslie wear welcome Hakeem and Leslie to the program.
[00:01:23] Lisa Woolfork: Thank you so much for taking the time to be with us today.
[00:01:26] Leslie Ware: Thank you. Listen. Yeah.
[00:01:27] Hekima Hapa: Thanks for having
[00:01:28] Lisa Woolfork: this book is a beauty.
[00:01:31] Lisa Woolfork: It is utterly beautiful from top to bottom, the cover. It's glossy and shiny and smooth and just amazing. And then when you flip through the pages, it's like an art book. It's like an art coffee table book, but one that's really also meant to be used.
[00:01:51] Lisa Woolfork: And so I think the book is such a beautiful hybrid of patterns, instructions, history, fashion, [00:02:00] it's one book that does many things and does all of those things well. So congratulations. And that leads me to my first question. How did you all come up with the idea of a book? I know Hakeem. Had been working with black girls.
[00:02:15] Lisa Woolfork: So, and starting this wonderful youth organization, that's teaching fashion principles and sewing to young folks. Well, how did the book come about?
[00:02:24] Leslie Ware: So I think that the book was always in the making, but it was very important that friendship that me and Leslie were able to put together in the last works we met, started with black girl soul using one of Leslie's works.
[00:02:38] Leslie Ware: Both having the same general mission. And then us just discussing how I would always jokingly say to Leslie, you should ghost write a book for me. And here it is, hold
[00:02:48] Lisa Woolfork: that beautiful. Leslie was like, I ain't ghost writing nothing since I'm putting my name on it. Absolutely. Tell me, Leslie, what did you bring to the creative process?
[00:02:58] Lisa Woolfork: Hakeem? You brought [00:03:00] your organization, you brought the young folks who were doing the sewing. Leslie, how did you get involved?
[00:03:05] Hekima Hapa: Well, this book is my fifth, so it was a lot of fun for me just to kind of take a lot of the skills that I've gotten from working on other books. So lessons that I've like learned, and like things that did in the previous books, like bringing them here.
[00:03:22] Hekima Hapa: So it was just really taking all the stuff that I've learned from pamphlets and like bringing it to this amazing book. I love it. You said it's an. I think just a lot of the lessons that I again have learned, have been able to shine through in the black girl. So book, so it, I would just say just all the creative stuff from the past.
[00:03:41] Lisa Woolfork: Really appreciate how the book does so many things. And one of the things I really like about it is the way that it talks about some fashion icon. And one in here that I have is Zelda Lynn BDI, because she's such an important figure in [00:04:00] faction overall, but also specifically I think for New York and Harlem and through the work that she did with entities through the Harry, you act that created this wonderful program.
[00:04:10] Lisa Woolfork: I ended up actually interviewing. Who worked with her who was taught to sew by her. Oh, wow. This was Dr. Diana and Ja beard. She's a Smithsonian curator. She's from New York. I mean like, honestly, could you imagine learning the sew from Zelda Viv, Val? I can't imagine. So. I'm excited that I talked to somebody.
[00:04:30] Lisa Woolfork: Who knew her in real life and learned from her. And then to see her again in your book, it's just like, yes. How did you decide which fashion icons to include in the book? Was this something that you all had a list of to begin? Like how did you make those choices?
[00:04:45] Hekima Hapa: Yeah. I have a list of all these like heroes, who I am inspired by, who are people who I feel like just haven't had enough shine and they're kind of like these hidden figures.
[00:04:55] Hekima Hapa: Fashion, because we always didn't have the platforms or [00:05:00] we weren't given the recognition. And so I wanted to do a podcast few years ago. That's just telling the stories of these people. And so when the opportunity came around to do this look with black girls, so they pulled out that list. And then, and I decided which ones, cause we couldn't
[00:05:15] Lisa Woolfork: include them.
[00:05:16] Lisa Woolfork: All
[00:05:16] Hekima Hapa: right. But maybe that can be
[00:05:18] Lisa Woolfork: another book. That's the next book? The sequel.
[00:05:21] Hekima Hapa: There's so much to learn from like all of these stories. And so we just narrowed it down to some of the ones that we thought were the most important to tell right now. I
[00:05:30] Lisa Woolfork: absolutely love that. And the idea of bringing in folks like Patrick Kelly, like all of these wonderful.
[00:05:38] Lisa Woolfork: Figures that we should know more about, and it should be household names that should be because they're such an important part of how we get to do what we do now. And so I love that the book brought that forward. I also had a question about why you thought it was important to bring in textile history.
[00:05:56] Lisa Woolfork: Because that's something that I thought was also a really great [00:06:00] contribution, like talking about denim, for example, I thought the whole essay denim was really good. And I just wondered if you wanted talk a little bit more about that and why textile history is important, especially the African American lessons or experiences with textiles that might differ from the mainstream history on the textile.
[00:06:21] Lisa Woolfork: Can you talk a little bit more about. I was
[00:06:23] Leslie Ware: gonna say for me, denim in particular, when you think about as a resource, how much water it takes to produce denim. So the idea of it being like a mainstay in my own line, it's very important. I talk to the children all the time about how easy it is to upcycled and how easily and readily available.
[00:06:42] Leslie Ware: It is, but it's not something easy to produce. So for me, it's really important that we think about it historically, the connection to it being cotton, how our ancestors are here. I think it's important when we talk about fashion and aesthetic Deni is a big part of that.
[00:06:57] Lisa Woolfork: Absolutely. Leslie, how about you?
[00:06:59] Lisa Woolfork: Like, why was it [00:07:00] important? I was really surprised. I guess I had not made this connection between denim and what the book describes as Negro, cloth as something that was really prevalent to be used by enslave folks. Can you talk a little bit or shed a little light on that history or that background?
[00:07:14] Lisa Woolfork: Because I think, yeah, it's this great comment about the resources it takes to make denim right now and why it's useful to kind of repurpose what we have. But back in the day, like hundreds of years ago, there was another thing with denim. That's also significant. And I thought that was really clever to bring that forward.
[00:07:31] Lisa Woolfork: When I
[00:07:31] Hekima Hapa: think about denim like black girls always have these amazing Deni pieces. And denim is like a really easy material for kids to like upcycle with because it's so durable. And so I knew that we really wanted to focus on denim. And then I really started thinking about my dad who was turned 88 years old last month.
[00:07:49] Hekima Hapa: And kids' relationship to them. Some of the stories that I heard from him growing up. Denim and kids, he didn always wear denim and that denim had this kind of [00:08:00] association to poor people are share cropping or just needs stories that are attached to it that we don't think about anymore necessarily associated with denim, because it's just all a part of American culture and popular culture and just what we wear.
[00:08:17] Hekima Hapa: And so I thought it would be important to highlight it and to give. Textile a moment in the book where we could dig a little bit deeper into its history.
[00:08:26] Lisa Woolfork: I really do love that. And you talk about this in the context of genes, have a long history with blacks in America prior to share cropping days, Deni was referred to as clothes for Negros.
[00:08:39] Lisa Woolfork: And explaining what share cropping was explaining how denim dress was the dividing factor between who was seen as valuable or wealthy or upper class and who wasn't, and then what it meant to reclaim that and reinvigorate that legacy to acknowledge and move forward at same time. It's really very, very [00:09:00] powerful.
[00:09:00] Lisa Woolfork: And also to give this really rich cultural background. Two, the denim pieces that you're already creating and that the students are already doing, which I think is really beautiful. I really also thought in addition to the way that you do textile history and fashion icons, I just gotta say this book is so unusual.
[00:09:20] Lisa Woolfork: And rich and unique and why? I think it's absolutely essential is because you incorporate both fashion and black cultural knowledge. It is a very unique and powerful combination, unusual. And I think even unprecedented, honestly, to find color theory and the racist history of denim in the same book and to have that book to be for children, you congrat, and it's a smashing success.
[00:09:46] Lisa Woolfork: Can you talk about this unique. Bringing in, like here is color theory, but you talk about color theory in a way that connects it back to the diaspora. I don't know. It's just really beautiful. Can you share a bit about [00:10:00] that unique combination of bringing in both the fashion knowledge and the black cultural knowledges?
[00:10:06] Lisa Woolfork: Why is it important that kids know how to do.
[00:10:09] Hekima Hapa: I give an opportunity to do anything, especially like working on books in my head. I don't know if I'm gonna be able to do this again. It's like, I just want to give it like everything that I possibly can and that we can cuz I'm like, girls need to know this.
[00:10:26] Hekima Hapa: This is the moment that we have. And so sometimes it feels like it could be two or three books. Yeah. But like you just have to. Just do a lot with what you have, because this is the chance that we have right now. And so for me, and like my thinking around pulling the book together, and even all these things are like in the proposal, some of them were taken out because the editor was like, okay, like we can't do all of these things, but everything that they left in breast, we tried to accomplish it.
[00:10:54] Hekima Hapa: Maybe we didn't go as far as we could. But at least the nuggets are there where you can [00:11:00] go and explore and find out more on your own. So we just wanna peak curiosity in a way that will lead to something else, more learning. But yeah, I think it was just really about, this is our opportunity. Let get as much information figure out as we can in one
[00:11:16] Lisa Woolfork: book.
[00:11:16] Lisa Woolfork: It really is. Hakima. How about you? How do you feel about the compressed nature of your book? There's a lot of great information in there. Was there some that you left on the table? You were like, dang it. After we could have put this in there. I think
[00:11:29] Leslie Ware: I shared the same sentiment. It's who knows it will ever be able to do this.
[00:11:33] Leslie Ware: Get as much in as possible, make it feel like an encyclopedia, make it feel like a textbook so you can keep rediscovering different aspects of it. You can use it for your camps. You can use it for your classrooms. It can really be a reference piece.
[00:11:47] Lisa Woolfork: I absolutely agree. I absolutely agree. And you can see if you look at my copy, I've got these little.
[00:11:54] Lisa Woolfork: I love it. I
[00:11:55] Hekima Hapa: love the tabs. All right, love that. Can you send us a picture of
[00:11:59] Lisa Woolfork: [00:12:00] that? Right. I made bookmarks really like there's only two bookmarks, cause I only made four bookmarks. So I got two for one book and two for another, but there are absolutely things I'm gonna come back to and pay more attention to.
[00:12:11] Lisa Woolfork: Now there's so much that you teach and share in this book. Can you share one lesson each that each of you all learned in the process? Is there something that you like now that this is all done? It's over the book is finished. It's gorgeous. It's on shelves. It's in stores. It's in the hands of consumers who are very enthusiastic like myself.
[00:12:32] Lisa Woolfork: What did you learn from the process? What did you take away? I know for me personally, I
[00:12:37] Leslie Ware: learned a lot of patience, a lot of trusting the process. I think that there are parts and portions of the book that were not necessarily in my personal control that I had to trust that Leslie's direction and leadership was going to have the outcome that it did.
[00:12:53] Leslie Ware: So that would be my biggest lesson. It's really like trusting the person that you trusted this baby too. [00:13:00] Knows
[00:13:00] Lisa Woolfork: exactly what she's doing. Excellent. That's excellent. Leslie, how about. I think
[00:13:04] Hekima Hapa: writing a book in the pandemic, it's challenging because you're dealing with all of the things that are happening.
[00:13:10] Hekima Hapa: We didn't leave our houses. When we did the photo shoots, we were under certain restrictions because of like masking and just even sourcing fabric was difficult because the fabric stores weren't even open when we first started doing this. And so. What I thought it would be easier to write a book in the pandemic because, oh, we're just in the house, but it ended up having its pros and cons.
[00:13:33] Hekima Hapa: Cause I imagined us being more collaborative cuz when we signed the deal, it was right before the pandemic happened. So I was like, I'm gonna be in this team once a week and we're going get to test these things out. And it just ended up being zoom calls and text messages and Google documents because we were both in Brooklyn, but not really able.
[00:13:52] Hekima Hapa: To have hangout. So I think for me, a big lesson was just the logistics of writing a book in a pandemic. You present [00:14:00] challenges and opportunities, but we made it happen despite all of that.
[00:14:05] Lisa Woolfork: So y'all your book was a pandemic baby. It definitely was . So how they say them? Pandemic babies are built different.
[00:14:12] Lisa Woolfork: Your book is endemic baby. It's so wonderful. It is such a gorgeous gift. I'm gonna take a quick pause here to remind folks who are on Patriot and are seeing what I'm seeing. Hey friends. Hey, I wanted to share a little bit about the abundance of the stitch please podcast. The growth of the podcast has been so exponential that the work has exceeded what I am able to do.
[00:14:37] Lisa Woolfork: And this is where you come in to retain the joy practice and the liberatory vision of the podcast and to not have it reproduce capitalist extraction and overwhelm. I am recalibrating the black woman's stitch Patreon for increased sustained financial support. You can find links to the black woman's stitch Patreon in the show notes and be on the lookout for [00:15:00] more information as the recalibration unfolds.
[00:15:03] Lisa Woolfork: And thank you for your support.
[00:15:08] Lisa Woolfork: I am coming to you with these two beautiful black. Who I think are in their own space of business. I think Leslie is coming to you from the dressing room, which is located in times square, New York city of all places. And I think Hakima, are you at your Makerspace? I'm a black girl magic street, Tom in Brooklyn.
[00:15:31] Lisa Woolfork: It's located right there. You know, everyone wonders where black girl magic is, but you know, it has an actual.
[00:15:36] Leslie Ware: It does. It's 3 84 at Hopkins avenue.
[00:15:39] Lisa Woolfork: That is exactly is coming from. Tell me y'all about how was it balancing, managing your own work, right? Because this is your pandemic baby, but it's also not your only child's.
[00:15:52] Lisa Woolfork: How do you manage balancing this beautiful shop, the art to wear the studio, the gallery, all the wonderful things that you're [00:16:00] doing last week, and then all of the teacher that you do Hakeem the teaching, the fashion shows the direction, working with the kids and getting their materials together. How did you manage to balance all of that and write a book?
[00:16:11] Lisa Woolfork: So I would say one
[00:16:12] Leslie Ware: lesson was able to keep me on task, which is quite the task, but two that it gave us something to look forward to while the first year during the pandemic, we weren't able to have summer camp. So that was a different space for me, cuz I had been doing in-person summer camp for. Seven years at that point to me, I get a recharge with the children during the summer.
[00:16:32] Leslie Ware: It makes me more creative. It reignites my passion for sewing, and I wasn't able to get that, but the book was able to do that.
[00:16:39] Lisa Woolfork: That's beautiful. It enhanced what you were doing. It didn't like crack or distract from it. How about you? How'd that work for you?
[00:16:47] Hekima Hapa: I think the book really helped me to have a routine.
[00:16:51] Hekima Hapa: So a lot of my. Friends in the pandemic were like, we just slept the whole time. We were having a hard time feeling inspired and creative. And for me, this [00:17:00] book meant, okay, you need to get up every morning at 6:00 AM, because I was also teaching fashion design at a high school on zoom during the pandemic.
[00:17:08] Hekima Hapa: So I would get up at six and work on the book until nine and then like do my teaching at the school and then work on the book. So it was like, I think I love what Hema said about just something to look forward to. So something that we're working on now that would come to like later on down the road.
[00:17:24] Hekima Hapa: But I think for me it was a routine. So like I could have easily just been like with the kit and eating cheese pumps, but instead I actually worked on something that means something and that we have now. And. For me, it was about just routine and having something else to do besides be in a house and be worried and be unproductive.
[00:17:45] Hekima Hapa: So I'm like thankful to Abras for believing in this project and our editor Meredith there and up for working with me and interesting me with this baby.
[00:17:58] Lisa Woolfork: It's so [00:18:00] wonderful. I had to ask y'all what was it like being on good morning, America, first of all, did you have to get up very. I can tell already that Leslie does not care about getting up early.
[00:18:09] Lisa Woolfork: Leslie is not a morning person. So Leslie does care about getting up early, but I'll get up if I have, but how do you maintain this? Six to 9:00 AM work schedule on the regular, I guess this is what you have to look forward to for me. Yeah, 6:00 AM. I'm just turning over. Good.
[00:18:27] Hekima Hapa: good morning. America was fun.
[00:18:29] Hekima Hapa: We actually shot the segment. Wasn't it? Four o'clock. It was in the afternoon. On a Friday. Yep. so it was not in the morning. I enjoyed it. I thought it was great. It was different than what we imagined again, because it's still a pandemic. And so we thought we were gonna be indoors. We thought it would look a little differently, but we had to tape it outside.
[00:18:49] Hekima Hapa: It was raining so if you can't see that. Someone holding an umbrella, like we had to wipe ourselves off, but we got through it and I think this, this [00:19:00] great. It was such a cool experience to be beyond the morning, America, the chemo. What was it like for you? We haven't talked about this. I think it was fantastic.
[00:19:09] Leslie Ware: The experience itself, like she said,
[00:19:10] Lisa Woolfork: was kind of on Orthodox. What I love most about it
[00:19:13] Leslie Ware: was I don't talk to many people from the small town that I grew up in. I've been in New York city for a really long time. And this was one time that they got to
[00:19:21] Lisa Woolfork: see
[00:19:22] Leslie Ware: what I do. My first viewing of it was someone who filmed their television and sent it to my one childhood friend and said, is she friend?
[00:19:31] Leslie Ware: And so I just thought that was pretty special. She tagged me on Facebook. I don't use my birth name. And so they like wrote my government name and they were
[00:19:39] Lisa Woolfork: like, I think that's
[00:19:40] Leslie Ware: who this is. But the best part about it was that they just acknowledged the fact that my mom taught me the soul. A lot of the comments was like, oh, her mom was an awesome seamstress.
[00:19:48] Leslie Ware: I could see how that made
[00:19:49] Lisa Woolfork: sense. So that made me feel really. Oh, that's so beautiful.
[00:19:52] Hekima Hapa: I agree with teki too. Like it was for me, my family is what doing in New York. Right? Why aren't you just using your [00:20:00] degree? You are opening a store. And so like being on good morning, America was very validating because if it's like TV, that means that it's real.
[00:20:09] Hekima Hapa: And that you're doing something that is worthwhile. My dad finally all came together. Like everyone from church was calling her. She was like upset that I didn't tell her sooner. I'm like, you don't have cables. I knew you in front of that.
[00:20:21] Lisa Woolfork: Eventually. It's really beautiful to see that the book that you've created is something that's so generative.
[00:20:28] Lisa Woolfork: It's not just one thing. It is really an invitation to a process of imagination and curiosity and creativity and making and doing and dreaming. It's really wonderful. And I think the book itself is like a love letter to black. That's something that I really love about it. And so I wonder if you have any ideas or thoughts about what you want folks to take away from the book.
[00:20:57] Lisa Woolfork: I feel like it's a book that's giving a lot of gifts and I [00:21:00] wonder what are some of your hopes that people will take away with it after reading and experiencing, and projects and stuff? I think for me,
[00:21:07] Leslie Ware: it's just the possibilities. The possibilities of who you can be because you have the hidden figures portion of it.
[00:21:13] Leslie Ware: It's the imagination portion of it that it sparks. So it's just really like, you can do anything. You can do anything within fashion. You can do anything with just in general, but I want you to close that cover and feel like I'm gonna go back again and again, and there's always gonna be something that it spark.
[00:21:28] Leslie Ware: I love
[00:21:29] Hekima Hapa: it. I do too. I just wrote down anything that's possible. So basically the same thing that Kima just said, I always say a lot of the books that I write and projects that I worked on are things that I wish I would've had at the girl, because like I came to fashion in a different way and I. Probably would've just jumped right into it.
[00:21:48] Hekima Hapa: If I knew that it was something that could be like a career and the thing that you could develop and make a lot of money doing, if you do it the right way or make connections. And so, anyway, I think I wanted [00:22:00] to just say, tape this and run with it and yeah. Know that anything
[00:22:03] Lisa Woolfork: is possible. Anything is possible.
[00:22:05] Lisa Woolfork: That is so beautiful. I'm gonna ask you one last question. This is the question I ask everybody. I forgot to tell you. I was gonna ask you this so surprised it's easy. The slogan of the stitch please podcast. Is that we will help you get your stitch together. I'm gonna ask each of you, what advice would you give to someone to help them get their stitch together?
[00:22:26] Lisa Woolfork: So just think about that for a second. And I think I'll start with Leslie. What advice would you give to someone to help them get their stitch together? Like
[00:22:35] Hekima Hapa: stitch together and sewing or stitch together as a life or stitch together as a love,
[00:22:41] Lisa Woolfork: any, yes. Any at all, all and done, whatever it means to you, whatever advice or wisdom you would give somebody to help them get their stitch together.
[00:22:49] Lisa Woolfork: Like someone's just like I'm in legal direction. I don't know what to DOCHA has some good advice. And then Leslie says
[00:22:55] Hekima Hapa: this, write it down. So I do have like all these [00:23:00] little notebooks, I keep notebooks in my tote bag at my desk. I'm just always writing things down. And even if I don't look back at them frequently, they just magically happen.
[00:23:11] Hekima Hapa: And for a while it was taking notes on my phone and I felt like things weren't happening digitally for me. And so I recently went back to this paper in pen. So I would say to get your stitch together, you gotta write it down and that'll help it come to fruition.
[00:23:26] Lisa Woolfork: I love it. I love that. Write it down. How about you?
[00:23:30] Lisa Woolfork: Hakima I would
[00:23:31] Leslie Ware: say, keep trying, keep trying. This is the first book that I've personally been a part of writing, but it's something I've wanted to do probably for a lifetime. I have a really good sister and she reminds me constantly, like you told me, 20 years ago, you were gonna write a book. She said, I remember you were pissed off with fashion design.
[00:23:49] Leslie Ware: You walked outta your shop and slammed the door, came behind you to make sure you were okay. And you blurted that outta your mouth. So I would say, just keep trying. Even when it seems impossible, it doesn't seem like it's gonna [00:24:00] happen, whether it's stitching and you're making a garment or it's really like the stitching in life. Just keep trying y'all.
[00:24:06] Lisa Woolfork: Thank you. And on that note, I am so grateful to have had this conversation with Leslie wear and Hakeem hop about this gorgeous pandemic baby of a book, black girls. So it says projects and patterns to stitch and make your. But it is a love letter to black girls. It is a manual for everybody.
[00:24:28] Lisa Woolfork: And I thank you both so much for bringing it to the world. Thank you.
[00:24:33] Hekima Hapa: Thank you for having us,
[00:24:34] Leslie Ware: Lisa. Thank you, Lisa.
[00:24:39] Lisa Woolfork: You've been listening to the stitch please podcast. The official podcast of black women's stitch, the sewing group where black lives matter. We appreciate you supporting us by listening to the podcast. If you'd like to reach out to us with questions, you can contact us at black women's stitch, gmail.com.
[00:24:55] Lisa Woolfork: If you'd like to support us financially, you can do that by supporting us on [00:25:00] Patreon. P a T R E O. And you can find black women stitch there in the Patreon directory. And for as little as $2 a month, you can help support the project with things like editing transcripts and other things to strengthen the podcast.
[00:25:14] Lisa Woolfork: And finally, if financial support is not something you can do right now, you can really, really help the podcast. By rating it and reviewing it anywhere. You listen to podcasts that allows you to review them. So I know that not all podcast directories or services allow for reviews, but for those who do for those that have like a star rating, or just ask for a few comments, if you could share those comments and say nice things about us at the stitch please podcast that is incredibly helpful.
[00:25:42] Lisa Woolfork: Thank you so much. Come back next week and we'll help you get your stitch together.

Hosted by Lisa Woolfork

Lisa is a fourth-generation sewing enthusiast who learned to sew while earning a PhD in African American literature and culture. She has been sewing for more than twenty years while also teaching, researching, and publishing in Black American literature and culture.

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